Texas Team Players Admins Are Morons

[Minty]

We have been listed on three topsites run by Texas Team Players (TTP) for probably over a year. All of a sudden when we start to get large amounts of traffic and unseat them from their strangle hold on top spot they suspend our site without warning. It was only after I sent an e-mail enquiring what was going on that I got a message, that was to say the least abrupt and clearly written by someone suffering from a large and undeserved ego, informing me that we were suspected of cheating. This arrogance becomes even clearer as the messages continue.

The reason for posting this is not revenge or malice, it's simply to point out the true nature of the people running TTP. They have removed a number of sites that had been at the top during the time we've been listed on these topsites and given the accusations they have made and not been able to back up I suspect that this was the case with these clans as well. Since they have a flawed philosophy which results in them making accusations they can't substantiate, act irrationally, plus place terms on people that are unreasonable I felt it was something that had to be brought out into the open.

Here's the whole sequence of e-mail exchanges. You'll notice that the guy, bigdog, gave me permission to post this exchange of messages in one of his arrogant replies. Have fun and have a laugh reading their stuff. Oh ya, after this last message he never responded, gotta wonder if he finally got smart or knew he was caught red handed being an over bearing jerk.

We start at my last reply dated Thursday, November 27, 2008 10:53:56 AM:

Since I gave you the courtesy or reading your last message I expect the same from you.

You've done nothing but throw around opinions, make accusations and try to belittle me and yet your and admin for TTP, what's that say about the organization?

An unwillingness to share information which has cost us is not a basis to call someone a cheater, that's a childish response to an unfulfilled need to be in control.

Here's something you should be reading direct from the Alexa web site (taken from http://www.alexa.com/site/help/traffic_learn_more):

Some Important Disclaimers
The traffic data are based on the set of toolbars that use Alexa data, which may not be a representative sample of the global Internet population. To the extent that our sample of users differs from the set of all Internet users, our traffic estimates may over- or under-estimate the actual traffic to any particular site.
In some cases traffic data may also be adversely affected by our "site" definitions. With tens of millions of hosts on the Internet, our automated procedures for determining which hosts are serving the "same" content may be incorrect and/or out-of-date. Similarly, the determinations of domains and home pages may not always be accurate.
Sites with relatively low traffic will not be accurately ranked by Alexa. Alexa's data comes from a large sample of several million Alexa Toolbar users and other traffic data sources; however, the size of the Web and concentration of users on the most popular sites make it difficult to accurately determine the ranking of sites with fewer than 1,000 monthly visitors. Generally, traffic rankings of 100,000 and above should be regarded as not reliable. Conversely, the closer a site gets to #1, the more reliable its traffic ranking becomes.

Also worth reading is this response I got from a Quantcast representative (I'll be happy to forward you the original if you don't believe me that this was from a true e-mail) :
From: Quantcast-Support [mailto:Quantcast-Support@quantcast.com]
Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 12:12 PM
To: Hart Lemmle; Publisher
Subject: Re: Tracking info

Hi Hart,

You are correct, if you place our tag on your site we will be able to directly measure your traffic, no matter how small.

If you didn't add the tag, it's hard to say exactly how much traffic you would need, as it depends on many variables. Our program is completely free, and once Quantified your information would show up accurately in search results. Let me know if I can answer any other questions.

Best,

Mike

On 12/2/08 9:50 AM, "Hart Lemmle" <hart> wrote:
Could you please let me know if my site will show any statistics (it doesn't now) if I don't have your tracking tag within my web site's script or does my site get so little traffic that it"s under your radar? Also if it will be tracked even without the tag how much traffic would be required for it to show when I do a search for it on http://www.quantcast.com/profile ?

Hart
So in fact this whole thing smacks of you being caught making a mistake and now trying to cover it up. I've been consulting to universities and colleges for over 25 years teaching physiology to a variety of students in both academic and sales courses. What I see is classic of someone who needs to be in control and has been caught making an error in judgment. This goes hand in hand with your choice of name as well, bigdog. Looks like you have a dire need to be on top and in control. You toss around opinions and massage figures to your advantage without ever considering that your wrong just so you can slander people. You rely heavily on web site traffic monitors when the people who run these services admit they are flawed.

Wonderful, you found a mistake I made, the link in the TF2 server was supposed to be to our Join U4EA page not the landing page, it's been corrected. However, your opinion that it's wrong to have a link to our website in the MOTD is way off base. It is in effect exactly the same as me going to your top sites and clicking on a link to another clan. I chose to go into a game server, if I choose to click on a link I do, very simple.

I don't have to click on a link in any MOTD nor do I have to click on any link on your top sites, if I chose to do so I thereby indicate that I want to visit this site. Since I am paying to have servers hosted I darn well better be able to place a link to my web site. Having this link does not generate a hit to my site till someone chooses to click on the link which again is the same as visiting your top site and clicking on a link. Am I clear enough for you here?

This is not server game tracking as you seem to think it is since, and I'm willing to bet on this, less than 10% of people joining a server will click the link. If the vote button script was included then it would be game server tracking. But then again, that wouldn't work as the vote button script doesn"t function on any site but the domain it was registered against unless you have tampered with the original top site script which you most likely have if your vote buttons produce hits in this way.

Insisting that people in game servers browsing the net is different from someone using a browser on their desktop is a load of crap, that's nothing more than your simple opinion. If I chose to browse through a game interface I am free to do exactly that.

Vote based topsites are irrelevant! How arrogant! Stating that people actually choosing to vote for their team is irrelevant is like saying that any vote someone makes for a politician is irrelevant. People have to actually push the button not just visit the page. Just how warped is your thinking?

Since when is it up to you to make the determination of what counts as an honest visit to any clan site? You may insist that any clan listed on your sites comply by your childish rules but those that do can only be labeled as stupid, fist of all for letting you dictate what they are allowed to do and second for not getting the proper value out of the server they are paying for.

As for the length of my last message, have a look at your own responses then criticize my attempts to inform and educate you. If all I did was throw around accusations my messages would be shorter as well.

All I've seen from you is baseless accusations and no evidence of us cheating. You have not found nor will you find any vote button script in any of our server MOTD scripts. You won't find us using any method to cheat, all you have uncovered is your petty need to be in control and dictate terms to others.

By the way you completely ignored my request for information on why the spam has been ignored on the top site clan reviews instead of being removed as outlined in your own TOS, nice one.

So keep your opinions to yourself and stop making accusations you can't back up. What I can back up is the case against you for slander, you have given me more than enough material to do so.

Remove my site from your worthless topsites. As you said "Stop wasting my time. Show proof, or stop replying."

Hart

P.S. This will as per your authority be posted on several sites and everyone will see you made accusations without cause and it will reflect on TTP as a whole.

From: Texas ...TeamPlayers... [mailto:texasteamplayers@yahoo.com]
Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 10:05 PM
To: Hart
Subject: Re: Removal of U4EA Site From Your TopSites

At the end of the day, Hart, all I see here is a bunch of "we're not going to divulge" this, and "we're not going to explain" that.

Typical of topsite cheaters.

http://www.game-monitor.com/tf2_GameServer/63.211.221.160:27015/-U4EA-_MUG_DA_PUNK.html

Your TF2 server (the first one I checked), has your homepage, and thus your topsite icon(s), in it's MOTD or related content. Your "joinu4ea.com" link has people in-game going to your website homepage, which is against the rules. We aren't in the business of counting game server hits, or players in-game browsing the net. You knew this when you signed up.

Regardless of whether I waste my time contacting each and every cheater is irrelevant. We suspend now, because we know the users that matter will come to us, run their mouths, or explain their case. You've done a bit of both.

Vote-based topsites are irrelevant. They mean nothing other than people like to spam votes on worthless websites to keep themselves on the top of a ladder....a ladder ranking those who likes to spam the most votes, and nothing more.

As for alexa not picking up your recent spike.....Alexa stats are compiled daily. You've had weeks worth of data (which we waited on to see before suspending you, in order to have evidence against your excuses). Quantcast, regardless of you being listed, measures websites. Check their top100, and see how many are not quantified. TTP wasn't quantified, yet we still were being tracked. Now, we are members due to some of our advertisers wanting to see the data.

I don't want your server logs. I don't want excuses. I don't want "secret tricks" you know on how to make your traffic 5X in a week. I want sites that rank highly on the tracker to make sense, be consistent with other means of being tracked, their own published website stats on users online and forum usage, and show some stability and history of being a legitimately high ranking site. Yours fails all of those requirements. All the ones I linked to you....various high ranking sites on our trackers.....hold up when compared on Alexa and other databases. You can wish away the public facts....but that's the way it is.

You want me to trust you, then start making sense, and stop writing essays. You are suspended until you show SOME EVIDENCE as to how your site spiked the way it did. That's google analytics data, alexa/quantcast/_____ rankings, or other VERIFIABLE means, and not simply word of mouth. I've got the evidence needed to back up your suspension. So what do you have?

Stop wasting my time. Show proof, or stop replying. Feel free to splash this up and down your forums, blogs, or even on your homepage. Anyone who looks at the situation sees nothing more than an unrepentent cheater, regardless of whether you are cheating or not.

Prove you are not, and your suspension is removed, and you guys are #1 or so on every tracker you have servers for.

...bigdog...

________________________________________
From: Hart <torx>
To: Texas ...TeamPlayers... <texasteamplayers>
Sent: Monday, December 1, 2008 3:01:36 PM
Subject: RE: Removal of U4EA Site From Your TopSites
Bigdog, you mention using the vote button code within a servers motd.txt file (this was also mentioned in a post on the topsite), since I control the servers and all config files I know what"s in these files, I challenge anyone to find a link code, for your top sites or any other top site, in any of our servers configs. As for using our index.php page for our modt.txt/html, if you figure out how to do this successfully I'm sure you will be among a select few with such knowledge. I have been running Aardvark script for top sites for years. I have played around with the vote button script in an effort to see how someone could cheat and have never been able to get it to register a vote nor a hit if not used in the domain it's registered against.

Some of our members got very upset, it didn;t surprise me to see how they responded, as for controlling them you may want to look at what was posted by someone who appears to be associated with TTP, very much in the same vein. I nor you control every single one of the people in our associations and as such cannot dictate how any of them are allowed to react. I can only stress the need to maintain a certain level of class. You'll note that the only descriptive words used were (as I recall) n00b, armatures, and faggots. There are few clans that would keep it at that level and we both know that the great majority of FPS players use language which is several levels below what was posted. I also understand why they were so upset. We work hard to keep hacks out of our servers, we have removed members immediately when we have had any evidence that they were cheating or using dodgy config's. So to be removed and basically labeled cheats hit hard. Using the reaction of our members as a determination of our guilt is in itself childish.

Yes our hits did spike, it was a surprise to us as well just how much more traffic we started getting. How did we do it? That;s something that I;m simply not going to divulge. We worked hard and I will say this much, our search engine hits went waaay up. Our weekly Join U4EA submissions went from 3 or 4 a week to over 20 a week.

You looked at our forum statistics, I agree our forum traffic is low, very low in comparison to many other sites, what you guys missed was the actual traffic to the landing page. We have had anywhere from 70 to 250 people on the site at a time basically between 8 or 9 AM MST to midnight on any given day. Yes I am very aware of Alexa for web details, u4ealounge.com is not the only site I take care of, the site is part of many that are simply set up for a hobby. Beyond these I maintain commercial sites as well, hence the understanding of Alexa and the issues it often has with accuracy. I have been using Alexa to track this site for the last 18 months and typically it shows an inverse account of what;s happening on our site, the more traffic we get the lower it ranks the site, the less traffic we get the higher it rates it. Not a very accurate tool to use for assessing a web site is it? It also only shows 21 sites linking in yet I personally know of at least another 70 sites with direct links to ours, this is aside from top sites we're on or link exchange sites which don't use, we're not looking to be penalized by Google. As for Quantcast, the sites not registered. So basically if your depending on these sites to be accurate tools to determine if a site is cheating you'll ultimately end up making more mistakes. Also flawed is your assumption that with us pulling the numbers we are we should have a better ranking within something like Alexa stats. As you know the increase in the number of visitors to our site started not quite 3 weeks ago, not enough time to bring about a true representation of our traffic.

You may also want to look at our stats on other top sites we use, not just the page view site's, we generally rank high within the top 5 on most sites we're listed on that require votes in. Our guys see it as something to be proud of, keeping the site ranked at the top.

Yes it was thanksgiving weekend and I do understand that people aren't going to be online as often as they would normally be, I could turn this around and say that because it was thanksgiving you could have waited till after the holiday and till after communicating before suspending our site. Let's face it, your responding to my e-mail not initiating contact. What you did was to cast an irreversible shadow of doubt on this clans trust worthiness. If you would have waited till we communicated before taking action there's no doubt I would have been more forthcoming with details on how we generate more hits and our server logs, I generally don't mind sharing information but after what"s taken place that"s not going to happen.

You may also want to read through your own TOS and remind yourself of what's stated within it. Your sites are plagued with spam messages, have been for some time yet your TOS emphatically states that you will not allow spam, amongst other types of messages. Also stated is "Any site that is suspected of cheating will be contacted immediately, and the matter will be resolved either by explanation or by removal of the site." You didn't contact me, you suspended the account first.

End of the day, you're not going to trust us so you may as well remove our site, we will stay off any site that we know is operated by TTP in the future as well.

Hart


From: Texas ...TeamPlayers... [mailto:texasteamplayers@yahoo.com]
Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 10:32 PM
To: Hart
Subject: Re: Removal of U4EA Site From Your TopSites

Dear Hart,

Your site wasn't removed. It was suspended. When our issues are addressed, it will be reinstated.

If your site has been getting higher traffic, why is that not reflected in your forum stats, membership registrations, or members online? Per your own forum stats:

Our users have posted a total of 429 articles
We have 367 registered users
The newest registered user is ORang3rs
In total there are 9 users online :: 0 Registered, 0 Hidden and 9 Guests

If you were getting the amount of traffic reflected in the topsite counters (http://www.fpsdaily.com/top100/index.php?a=stats&u=-U4EA-Minty says you make an average 1,082.3 unique users per day, with 4,154.8 pageviews. That is more than 10X your daily/weekly average for unique IP's a jump you made over night, at least as it appears in the trackers).

Marketing, advertising, name dropping, none of would have such an overnight affect. Drastic changes in traffic are almost always red flags for cheaters, and thus your site was suspended till you can explain why and where your new traffic is coming from. Keep in mind, there are public sources for traffic measurement. Such as:

http://www.alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details/u4ealounge.com

http://www.quantcast.com/profile/no-data-for-site?domain=u4ealounge.com

Neither of which show you having any significant traffic, or even traffic at all worth recording. Comparing your site to other major sites we rank, such as:

http://www.online-gaming-forums.com/
http://tf-2.org/
http://www.miaclan.net/
http://www.cod4central.com/ ( a new site that pulls huge, VERIFIABLE traffic)

...shows that your topsite ranking and website traffic to not match up. And that's the problem.

Our guess is, more than likely, you guys began placing your tracking icon on your game server MOTD's. That, or you are using your HOMEPAGE as your MOTD.html. This then gives you a unique impression when people connect to your game server. This is explicitly prohibited in the rules, since it is using the tracker to count game server "hits" and not website hits. I'm not sure why you believe this doesn't occur, but it does, and the same rules we enforce against it many other topsites do as well (such as http://www.csstop100.com/ ) To have your users spam the site so quickly with reviews against TTP, and so childishly, calling us noobs and amateurs for delisting you.only reflects the high probability that you ARE cheating, and got busted. That shame rides on you, and your lack of control or responsibility in this situation. It's thanksgiving weekend, and you can't expect people to have full access to their networks, email, or PC's.

As for insinuating that TTP removed your website because you took the top spot from us that's ridiculous. The Russian sites in TF2 are routinely ranked higher than we are. We were overtaken by cod4central.com long ago, and we list ourselves in CSS and L4D trackers (that we don't run), proudly taking 2nd and 3rd places. We earn the #1's and #2's and #3 spots that we have, with real traffic, that shows over time, and consistently. You got delisted because 2 other websites reported you for your spike in traffic, on 2 different trackers, not because we are jealous. If anything, it would be nice to see other communities of our size listed in the trackers. But there's just not that many to go around.

Yours..given your forum inactivity, low registration rate, and low post count/rate is not even close to the size of communities highly ranked on any of our trackers. MIA, or online-gaming-forums, or tf-2.org.those sites have 100's of posts a day. TTP frequently sees 1000's. http://www.texasteamplayers.com/index.php?action=stats .

Show some evidence that makes sense that you, and your WEBSITE are seeing some real traffic. Not your game servers. Your website. You should also keep in mind that none of our trackers are based on votes or clicks. Only on unique hits, averaged daily.

bigdog
Topsites admin
www.texasteamplayers.com


________________________________________
From: Hart <torx>
To: texasteamplayers [at] yahoo [dot] com
Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2008 10:53:56 AM
Subject: Removal of U4EA Site From Your TopSites
You have removed our site from three of your topsites without explanation. According to your own Terms of Service the procedure for dealing with suspected cheats is as follows:

1. Any site that is suspected of cheating will be contacted immediately, and the matter will be resolved either by explanation or by removal of the site.

Since no one has contacted myself to indicated that cheating has been suspected please explain your decision to remove our site from your site's ranking system's. We had been struggling to get more traffic to our site for a long time and when we finally get more traffic you remove our site. I am basing this whole message around my suspicion that we were removed because someone suspected we were cheating, I can see no other reason to remove us from the three sites as our members are active in all three games and we run at least 2 BF2 servers at all times plus servers for BF 2142 and DoD:S on a routine basis.

If you feel we are cheating have the common courtesy to at least approach me on it. I would be happy to supply our server logs showing the actual traffic we have been getting within the last two weeks, the time period where we started getting much higher volumes of traffic.

I personally run 29 TopSites using the same script you are. I understand how people cheat when someone has to actually VOTE for a clan however, the way your sites are set up you are merely providing a hit counter service based on unique IP access every 24 hours. I have yet to see a cheat which allows this kind of volume of traffic. Even if you took all of the proxies on the planet and tried to access only one site you wouldn't be able to get the numbers we have been getting because of the time it would take. I believe I have seen every cheat available when it comes to topsites, I know how it's done and I know how to block the majority of them.

There is only one other reason I can think of that you would remove our site, that you would be so petty as to remove a site that took you out of first place. I hope that this isn"t the case as this would indeed reflect poorly on an organization that is trying to make headway in an area dominated by the availability of leisure dollars.

Hart

-U4EA-MINTY www.u4ealounge.com